I have not had a bad experience with these guys, but this blog raises some good points.

Michael P

http://www.neutralsource.org/content/blog/detail/1185/

The price differences aren't too bad but I always check before pulling the trigger. No bad experiences yet.

Many of the wines come from "virtual wineries" that don't really exist. Look one up you've never heard of some time. The juice is probably some bulked-out stuff that a known producer can't sell.

There's a big retailer in the MD/VA area that does that. They buy it in bulk, have a meeting at the store to give it a name, and clear it through a wholesaler to make it legal. Happens all the time.

One that does happen it the the same wine will get offered repeatedly on different days, until sold out.
BD

Actually, I think this guy's research pretty much destroys his own argument.

Fact: Almost every WS quoted release price is high compared to what I can find the wine for. I have never calculated it, but unless it's a retailer in an affluent area that wants to tie his prices to the WS Mag, the price is lower.

Fact: In all cases, the WTSO price is lower than the release price. So who cares????

I've bought from them maybe 3 or 4 times. Never had a problem. It's good to be an educated consumer because I know when their deals are good and when they're not. But the wines I've bought have been ridiculously good deals. The one that stands out in my memory was the 2003 Casanova de Neri Tenuta Nuove Brunello. I got it for $24.99! That's normally at least a $70 wine. I maxed out what they would sell me.

J

I think this blogger is making way too big a deal over what usually amounts to a 5-10% increase in the mythical "release price."

I routinely see way bigger swings from region-region than I see on his comparison chart.

And as others have noted, he's still selling well below retail so what's the big fuss about?

Supply and demand rules, even in a heavily regulated market like wine. Most wine drinkers are downsizing to lower priced wines, or spending less, it's natural in this busted economy. Prices have to follow and the fact that this web site exists shows this. There is a glut of wine and it has to be moved, and pricing is the only way to move it. This is a good thing for the consumer, bad for the producer.

"There's a big retailer in the MD/VA area that does that. They buy it in bulk, have a meeting at the store to give it a name, and clear it through a wholesaler to make it legal. Happens all the time."

If you are talking about the chain I think you are, I worked for them for 3.5 years. The names are concocted at the headquarters, actually. We sold dozens and dozens of different "private label" wines, from all over the world, and the profit margins are incredible, even for the lower end wines. That is where the money is made, not on national brands bought from distributors at their normal markups. dc.

Expect to see Gaja Barbaresco back at $20 a bottle like the old days in the early 80's before this crisis is all over.:~)

dc.

Somebody I know worked at the Laurel store and told me how the wines were named. Supposedly they could be picked out by the color of the shelf talker. They also had a couple of incidents where the big wine cooler failed overnight and cooked the wines. Leakers everywhere. Anything that could be cleaned up was put back in.
Bob

My motivation that brought me to the link was trying to figure out who Jonathan H Newman was and why quote him.

On a side note: working in the business I have seen many people falsify, blatantly falsify a 90+ rating just to get the sale. And, yes, this was from a state manager of a small, boutique distributor in the state. The manager went so far as to create a website where he would review his own wine, the write shelf talkers and case cards quoting the website as if it were an independent source. SO, I am little weary when I see a name of a review with high praise and no track record. NO, I don't buy based on 92, 95, 90, etc. It's a guideline, reference point, etc.

SO, when I saw Newmann as the high score reviewer, I thought to look into it, found the link, etc.

NOW, if I could get Casanova di Neri TN BdM at $24.99 I am on board. Nice find JFO!

Michael P.

ps: today's wine, Vina Mayor Toro. I sell this wine (well, I don't sell it, but have it to sell). The price they have it at s crazy low, $10.99. The lowest I could see someone selling it here, if they bought a deal (10 cases plus 1 free) and marketed it well, but not too low, would be $16.99.

Bob,

The Marines who fought on Iwo Jima, when they returned home after the war to their families, would never, ever talk about their experiences on that island, unless it was to another Marine who had been there. Why? It was because the fighting on Iwo was so fierce and intense, the trauma kept them from discussing it outside of those that had experienced it. They had peered into the belly of the beast, into their own heart and souls, and had seen the monster that lay within themselves, and within the enemy, that could be unleashed under the right circumstances, a monster that could not be reconciled with the civilized world that they had come from.

I mention this because it is the best comparison I can come up with to describe the horrors I experienced in the retail wine world. The situation you describe is just typical of what goes on in that world. All the wines in that (locked) cooler were the ones that sell for $100 or more. Can you imagine a warehouse that is not temperature controlled during the summmer, with 1,000 cases of KJ Chardonnay cooking up just right for the typical customer in it? dc.

don't know if you discovered this or not, but the Jonathan H Newman you were seeking is a former director of the PLCB.

What is the PLCB?

Thanks,
Michael P.

Penn Liquor Control Board.

Ok, and thanks,
MP

Hmmmm, that makes you rethink all that.